How Women Can Overcome Wealth Challenges with Tracy Hilliard

Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00.086)

On average, women tend to be paid about 13 % less per hour. That also then impacts our pension from the point of view of potentially where women have time off. That discrepancy is quite major in my mind and therefore has implications about how we can manage our assets in the future.


If I can help one female, two females, 20 females, what a difference that will make to society because what I've found generally in the community is that once you help one, they help someone. And to me, this is a real opportunity for us to create a movement that does make a difference to women. Women can become financially independent just like I have.


Speaker 3 (00:35.054)

Welcome to this week's episode of WealthTalk. name is Christian Rodwell, the membership director for WealthBuilders, joined today by our founder, Mr. Kevin Whelan. Hi, Kevin.


Hi Chris, good to be with you again.


Yeah, episode 299. We're just one away from that big one.


Well, I wonder what's in store for number 300.


So do I, I've left stuff thinking about that one for me. No, we definitely have a treat in store for the big episode 300. But today we are diving into an important and often overlooked topic, and that's the journey of women in wealth. We know Kevin, that the playing field isn't completely level. Women still face some challenges and gender pay gap, lower pension pots, and less confidence around financial planning. So our guest today is Tracy Hilliard. Tracy's been a great member with us.


Speaker 3 (01:21.772)

for last four years, I think. And Tracy will be sharing her story. And also we've opened up a wait list for WealthBuilders for Women. So anyone listening today who would like to get their name on that wait list, head to wealthbuilders.co.uk forward slash women, and you'll find some more information there.


It's interesting because I think the macro, everybody knows, who knows me knows, I have an economics background and the macro, big picture, numbers in almost every area of wealth building life. Females start behind the curve a little bit. It's not for us to say the approach should be different for men and women, but there are differences and those differences have got to be acknowledged.


both from a macro point of view, what are the numbers and from a micro point of view, how do you deal with that? You know, I've definitely seen and spoken to some of our female property people who don't feel they're treated with respect often when they're dealing with trades, for example. And I've definitely seen the number of people who take up SaaS is 75 % men, 25 % women. You know, and the vast majority, you've heard me talk before about


the £27 billion worth of pensions floating around in the pension ether. So much of that is assigned to the fact that women often will take career gaps and breaks for whatever reasons, and know Tracy will touch on that. And they often forget about the pensions that have been left behind, pensions which could form part of their overall


future wealth, including being able to access that money in the SAS, for example, but rarely do because they either lose track, lose confidence, life gets in the way. And as a result, all of these circumstances conspire to make it more of a challenging playing field for the female wealth builder. albeit I think all good principles should be absorbed by males and females equally. I think it's good to hear.


Speaker 2 (03:32.834)

the passion in Tracy and how she feels about trying to do something about leveling that playing field herself. And she's an enthusiastic and willing share within WealthBuilders and I we need to acknowledge Helen as well. You want to say something about Helen?


Well, we've been running a focus group, Women in Wealth, for around about two years now, and that's been hosted very, very well by Helen Pollock. So massive thank you to Helen as well for all of her contributions towards this.


Yeah. And she's, you know, she shares the same enthusiasm as Tracy does. So I think it's great to hear that female perspective, recognizing that I've said many times before, and I'll just say it again before we hear from her, that good solid wealth building principles, you know, are equally applicable to men and women. But I think she's taking this cause to try and really provide a more female centric way of learning.


interacting, executing, building, protecting wealth in a way that has got a female orientation. Notwithstanding the fact women live longer than men and the vast majority of this great wealth transfer that we hear about from baby boomers to the next will pass into the hands of women who very often didn't have the responsibility or the confidence to be able to


to make those decisions simply because somebody else took charge. And I think I can understand that from my own perspective of an older husband with a younger wife. You know, I can see I've stepped up to the mark so much more in my family than she has, and she's provided a completely different role, equally valuable for the whole of the family and so super supportive. So quick nod to my wife, Sarah, who rarely gets a mention if ever, but you know, couldn't have done what I've done without her complete support from day one.


Speaker 2 (05:29.9)

When I got on the journey, she said, well, you better do it now. If you're going to do it before we have a family. And now we've got three grownup kids and that's all part of that thing really. And she took all of her time to look after them. And she's doing the same with our grandkids, you know? So I think there is something that has to be said about a female perspective on how to receive wealth, build wealth, and to feel part of a community where they're heard in the right way they want to be heard.


good time for us to head on over to our conversation with Tracy Hilliard, a Wealthbuilders member who began her journey feeling financially insecure, but within five years has achieved financial independence by following the Wealthbuilders process.


Tracy, welcome to WealthTalk today. How are you?


Very good, thank you for having me. I'm really looking forward to today.


It's fantastic to have you with us and Tracy, you've been a member since 2023 and we've seen your progress and looking forward to hearing about some of those steps that you've taken today. But let me ask you first, Tracy, because we're going to talk today about like women and wealth and can you share why you feel the wealth building journey is often different for women compared to men?


Speaker 1 (06:38.104)

Yeah, Chris, there's a few things that come to mind. I feel it's education. So usually a lack of education and you can say that's for men and women, but particularly for women, think confidence is the area that I've certainly identified in myself is a difference. So the lack of confidence that we have in understanding our financial position and also understanding our future. I think there's some societal expectations as well, Chris, that come to mind.


So for instance, previously I've been married, like I almost expected my husband to manage the finances. So there's a societal expectation. And I think the final thing I was just going to mention, and I know we'll come onto this a bit later, is some statistics that talk about the variance between what women and men earn, which we've probably heard in the press as well, as well as periods of time when women tend to leave the workforce to manage, whether it be kids or other caring responsibilities. And I think the...


assets that we have therefore sometimes are diminished a bit more. So for me, that's the three major areas that I would say are differences between men and women.


Yeah, well, let's get into some of those facts because there's some clear evidence out there, isn't there? And I know you've got those numbers. gender pay gap, that's certainly one place, isn't it, where there's not equality.


Yeah, and look again, is not anything's right or wrong. It's just the facts, right? So if we look at it on average, women tend to be paid about 13 % less per hour as an example. And that also then impacts our pension from the point of view of potentially where women have time off. And I looked at some stats this morning again, just to remind myself. So generally on average men tend to have about 84,000.


Speaker 1 (08:15.182)

pounds in pension and women tend to have about 39,000. Again, this is on average and you can see again there's a variance there. So there seems to be a few areas where that discrepancy is quite major in my mind and therefore has an implications about how we can manage our assets in the future.


those figures you mentioned, F pensions, that's at the point of retirement, is it?


Exactly right. you know, there's so many and again, this is just some facts. We're seeing these facts, probably people have read a lot about them and the implications means that therefore women will ultimately potentially have less when they retire. And as you know, women tend to live longer than men. Statistically again, they generally live to 83, men generally live to 79, so four year gap. So not only.


is there less pension in lot of cases, they also live longer, so they actually need more money. So there's some facts here that start to make me concerned about what we're doing with our wealth from a female perspective.


Do you believe that tradition that's probably generations preceding us where the man has always taken the role and perhaps, you know, managed the money of the family and the home? Do still think there's elements of that today?


Speaker 1 (09:25.62)

Yeah, I do think a little bit. think there is a change. I think the younger generation is seeing a difference where there's a bit more ownership. I'm my 50s now. I'm seeing some women change in their 50s, in their 40s as well. So there is a change in it, Chris. I don't think necessarily it's probably the same it was probably in the 70s. I remember my mom growing up. I don't think I ever talked about finances. I don't know whether you were the same with your mom, but...


a little bit older than you, but from my perspective, it wasn't something we ever discussed. My mom just worked very hard. In the end, she ended up buying a property. She got divorced and bought a property, but had to lie about how much money she had because otherwise she wouldn't have been entitled to actually even get a mortgage. So there's been quite an evolution, as you rightly say, but not necessarily to the stage where I think we've got the equality that probably is needed in society yet.


Yeah. And we've been running for quite some time at Wealthbuilders a monthly group called Women in Wealth. And we must give a nod to Helen Pollock, who's been leading that group and you presented in you recently. you know, it's been really good, hasn't it, to get the input from other female members of the Wealthbuilders community. And what are some of the questions and any different challenges that you've heard from that group yourself, Tracy?


Yeah, I think there's in my mind the evolution or the requirement for us to grow in confidence. you know, again, I think women are great at supporting each other in the right community. And I think WealthBuilders has that community, if I'm honest with you, about supporting one another in a really great way. So I'm seeing the confidence, the willingness to ask questions to Chris. think when women together, there's something about


the freedom and I think particularly, you know, areas like investing and trading can be quite complex. And I think when you're together as a female, you tend to feel a bit like this is too sophisticated for me to ask a basic question on what is a stock as an example. So I've generally found that when women get together, they have the freedom to ask maybe the basic questions, if that makes sense, to help them articulate and therefore educate themselves on what they need to do. So if the things I've been seeing is


Speaker 1 (11:34.604)

growth in confidence and a growth in education through things like the monthly sessions on women that helps that group learn from each other. And the thing I've loved about it so far is the willingness of connection. So if someone's got a problem, there'll be help from someone else. There's a real community spirit that I haven't seen across some other community support groups that I've been in that I think we're really lucky and well-built in.


Absolutely. We're really delighted, obviously, now that we're looking to evolve this into Wealthbuilders for Women. We've put a waitlist together, so wealthbuilders.co.uk forward slash women. This is something we're just at early stages with, isn't it, Tracy? We've been talking about this for a while, but I know it's really something that even from day one, you were passionate about sharing knowledge. Now, of course, with the journey you've had, which


I'd love to dive into in a moment with you. Just tell us about, you know, why you feel passionate about helping others.


Yep, I feel my journey has been from almost like a child to an adult. I think when I first started out on WealthBuilders, you think you know some things, but actually as start to unpick it, you realize that you know some things that probably haven't helped you. And I feel my journey is one that anyone can do. So if I can do it, I believe other women can do it. So what I've learned and what I've found is


If I can help one female, two females, 20 females, and I can help men as well, then what a difference that will make to society. Because what I've found generally in the community is that once you help one, they help someone. And to me, this is a real opportunity for us to create a movement, Chris, is a supportive movement that does make a difference to women, that women can become financially independent just like I have. If I can do it, they can do it. That's my belief in life. And I really feel this is an opportunity for us to make the biggest difference.


Speaker 1 (13:25.302)

In a group of people at the moment that as we talked about financially, probably not in the strongest position compared to men. So that's why I'm really passionate about it. And I think seeing myself go through it, seeing other women go through it, probably even seeing my mom go through it in my past, makes me realize that anyone can do it when they focus on it and they are really accountable for their own journey.


And Kevin and I often say the journey from financial insecurity to independence normally takes sort of five to seven years. You've done it even quicker than that, Tracy, which is brilliant. And when you first joined Wealthbuilders, what was your financial situation like? Can you remember?


funny, we were talking about this before, Chris, I think for me, we did the wealth map, which was really powerful because you might have money in certain situations or in a pension or whatever, and I had multiple pensions as well. And I realized when I looked at it, that firstly, I had in some cases more money, in other cases had less money. In many cases, I felt I didn't have the money. If I stopped working today, I wouldn't be after this is back then, I wouldn't be able to afford to look after myself and pay my bills. And it was a really


clear awakening about how different I needed to become to change my financial position. So I didn't have the education. I, and we can come on to this in a bit more detail, but I had a pension. So I knew a bit about pension. had a final salary scheme with a corporate I used to work with. So I had some money, I don't want to say. I had a small ISA at that point in time as well. So I had things, but I didn't know really what to do with it, Chris. And was almost like I had this bundle of stuff.


that was sitting there and I was just staring at every now and again going, what do I do with this? And almost putting it off because I didn't know or couldn't understand a company that I felt comfortable with because I think that's also what I've learned is to find people around me that willing to educate me and that I can trust. And those are the two things that are really important when I found WealthBuilders. And I've found that the overall experience has been amazing for me. So thank you.


Speaker 3 (15:29.12)

Yeah, no, thank you. And you were doing some education, weren't you? Just previous to WealthBuilders. So do want to tell us about kind of where things started for you?


Yeah. So I did start investing predominantly not trading, but in stocks and crypto. So I set up ISIS. So I had a bit of a knowledge around that. I choose individual stocks and I choose individual cryptos. I know there's other ways of investing, but for me that worked really well. And through that process, I've been able to increase my portfolio and then use that in other financial support situations and what I mean by that in my SaaS. So I've been after set up a SaaS.


small self-administrated scheme through my limited company. And what that's allowed me to do is to grow that as well. I almost view it as I had all these parts, but I didn't really know how to put the jigsaw puzzle together. And I think the pillars that you teach us about and that I've been able to apply have almost allowed me to put those pieces together in a better way. And I've got a far better picture than I ever thought I could have as a result of wealth borders and my previous education through investing as well.


that led into wealth borders in a really great way.


Yeah, you've referred to a couple of things there, which I'll just expand for anyone listening who's a bit confused by the terminology. And sometimes in wealth, there's a few new words to learn. And SaaS is a type of pension you said that what that stands for. It's a unique pension for business owners. And that was a real turning point for you, wasn't it?


Speaker 1 (16:54.2)

And this was just post COVID. remember, you know, monthly I was putting an amount of money from my business, my limited company into my pension. Cause I knew that was the right thing to do, if that makes sense. And I looked at it and I could see that it was going down. So every time I put the monthly amount in, it was decreasing. And then my financial planner at the point in time was talking to me about how he was buying another Tesla. And I thought he said, yeah, I have two Teslas. And I'm like, my money's going down and you're buying more Teslas. This type of doesn't feel right.


you're still taking your monthly cut of my pension. So what WealthBuilders allowed me to do and educated me in an area was how to own my own SaaS or set up my own SaaS through my legit company, which then meant I took my money out of my pension, moved it across to cryptos and stocks. And that all happened over about a six-month period. And I started investing in March 2024.


I'd like to share that I'm up over 90 % in my stocks and cryptos portfolio and that would be money I would not have made through the normal pension process and certainly wasn't because I was losing money as I said before rather than making money. So, and that's been me putting more and more money in as the months have gone on as I've grown in confidence and capability. But to me, I mean, 90 % over what an 18 month period that's not heard of really is it.


That's fantastic. One of the early things we do in the process is taking stock and looking at where's your income coming from. It's either earned income, time for money, or asset income. Of course, our focus is on creating asset income and recurring income that you can rely on, that you can spend that money each month. That's what gives you that true financial independence. But did you have earned income when you joined? Was it solely reliance on time for money income?


Yeah, was. mean, predominantly, I mean, I had some investments that I got dividends from a small amount of that. had one property, actually, I got my property after I joined you guys. So no, that was the major thing. So I had a, quarter I was given an investment because I worked for corporate and I gave us shares as part of that. So that was my starting point. So it was quite low, Chris, because it was, it was a few stocks, but not, not many shares overall that meant that it made enough money to be financially.


Speaker 1 (19:08.694)

independence. So it took a period of time to look at what I had and say, how can I change this into a way that gives me choices? And that this money can come to me in a way that I don't need to work as hard as I have in the past. And that was my real goal because the thing I found is worked really hard in my career, but it was very reliant upon me going to work, me making things happen rather than this is also like about wealth, but is is


How can I make money while I'm asleep? How can I make money while I'm not having to work? And I think that's the power and the difference too I found about WealthBuilders that I'd like to share with other people as well.


these are concepts that apply of course to men, women, everybody, right? The fundamentals of learning that you need to build up that asset income. For anyone listening now, particularly women who might not know kind of where to start, just to take a small step in the right direction to build up that confidence, what would be some tips from your side, Tracy?


think making sure and understanding where your money is. I had my money across, as you probably can tell by my accent too, I grew up in Australia. So I had a pension in Australia that I didn't know about. And I was like, how do I find this? I had a pension from a previous company that I worked at. So to me, it's almost like taking stock of where you are. And that's where I think for me, the wealth map was quite powerful. And I think anyone can list down just where their assets are, what houses they have, what money they have in the bank. To me, that's a really great place to start because at least you know what you've got.


and then you can decide what you're to do with it. So for me, I would encourage people to do that and to find their pension. you know, it's not substantial, but it's a little bit of money. eventually when I spend more time in Australia, I've got a pension if I want to pull on that. Now, I would not have known about that unless I had have come to WealthBuilders. I think the other things that came to mind that made a really big difference to me at the start too, was just even basic things like wills. Chris, I mean, we talk about this a lot.


Speaker 1 (21:01.228)

And I've been in situations where my family, my parents have died without wills. I mean, it's those types of things that are worth exploring. And to me, finding a way of educating yourself, mean, you know, obviously I talk about WealthBuilders, we talk about WealthBuilders, but how can you start educating yourself about what you want to start doing with your wealth, because all your money, with your assets, because to me, that's really, really key for us in understanding anything about what we're going to do in the future.


It's often when things are too late that we get that lesson, it? As you mentioned, their parents passing away or loved ones and finding out there wasn't a will and understanding the issues that that leaves behind. yeah, we try to educate in advance of these things, don't we, to make sure that you get these things done. And it gives you massive peace of mind as well.


Yeah, I think it's always awkward, isn't it? You know, if I think about my past situation, things happened that I'm sure my mom wished she had have left money for us and it never happened. And that's life. But you type of thing, I don't want that. I want to be clear on where I want to send my money or what I want to do with my money. Obviously what people do with that is up to them, but at least there's something written that confirms what I need and what I want for my family.


Yeah, I know it's a small thing, but it's actually a really big thing because also the stress that leaves on other people is always difficult anyway. People miss you, they obviously grieve in time and let alone having to work out what to do with Will's list. If that information is there, it's lot easier.


So that, I guess, is covered in protecting of the wealth in terms of simple steps. And you mentioned ICERs. It's really quite simple to set up an ICER, isn't it? But some people perhaps not aware of the benefits. Do you want to just share a little bit about that, Tracy?


Speaker 1 (22:44.11)

Yeah, no, I think again, you know, I'd heard of an ISA in the past, but hadn't necessarily focused on it. So as we know, or as hopefully people know, you can put up to 20,000 pounds per annum into your ISA. There's different choices around what you do with your ISAs. Obviously for me, I do buy and sell stocks through my ISAs, through my ISA. The benefit of that is any profit you make is tax free. So, you know, in my case, I've been able to use that 20,000 pounds each year.


Even if it's 10,000, even if it's 1,000, whatever money you make on it is actually tax free. So for me, as much as possible, I try and put my 20,000 if I can a year. And then it's about compounding. It's about getting that money to grow. So any profit I make, I leave there and then I make more and more money. And my goal is to hit a particular figure that gives me again choices about what I do with that money. So I have not taken any money out of my eyes since I've been doing this for the last four or five years.


And my goal is to increase that and to continue to actually make money through that and then make a decision about what I do with that money. But I love the fact Chris, that it's tax free. mean, to me, what a great bonus. And while it's here, let's use it is my type of logic. But even if you can put a hundred pounds a month or 50 pounds a month, by the time you get to the 12 months, it's still a reasonable amount of money that you can do something with that can make money. And that's the whole benefit in my mind about an ISA. So historically when, when I was struggling to put that amount of money in,


I just had an automatic withdrawal from my bank account into my ISA on a monthly basis and I almost didn't know it was going right because it just moved straight across and it was like, okay, where's that money gone? And even if it's hundred pounds, still 12,000 pounds, 12 to 1,200 pounds by the time the end of the year has happened, which is great money to then invest. So that's the benefit in my mind of using an ISA and the opportunities around it.


Yeah, and technology has made things so much easier now. Many of us do our banking through our phones and apps, and often you can have roundups which go into investing pots and things like this. the small list of steps is just a great place to begin, isn't it? It builds up confidence, it gets used to it, and then you can grow from there. And being surrounded by other people where you can learn, as you say, and you get that, I guess, reassurance that you're on the right track.


Speaker 1 (24:59.63)

For sure, for sure. That's made the biggest difference. think when you're uncertain, just to hear other people's journey, and as I always would say, whilst I might be here today talking about my journey, it's just because I've been doing this for a bit longer than other people, right? But people can be at the same place as me in maybe the three, four years or maybe five years, but it's just time. You need to put time in to make this work, right? And that's the thing I learned over the period of time as well.


So can you share a little bit more about your vision, Tracy, of how would this program differ, do you think, from the existing WealthBuilders Academy?


Yeah, I mean, to me, WealthBuilders have, you know, the pillars and a number of other areas that we've talked about. So for me, the foundation is similar. The only thing I would say is that what I would like to do is build this with women. So it's almost like, what do we need? the things that I think about is the type of support networks that we have, you how can we create that for women? That means women are getting the right support and the connection in the way that makes the biggest difference. The other part around education is.


Sometimes there's unique things that women need more education on. That might be something in relation to property. It might be in relation to their wills that might be specific to that female, that particular place. So for me, it's about tailor making a course that suits where we want to go as a group.


And my hope is that as we get this waste list going and we get people coming forward, Chris, that we can start to develop this together and say, look, these are the three things that are going to make the biggest difference to us as a community. And that's what we focus on. So for me, this is an evolution of where we could go as a group. And I think the power behind community, which offsetting wealth borders means that we could create this in a way that meant we had input, we had ownership, and we had clarity as a group of females in a very different way. Yeah.


Speaker 3 (26:48.33)

The WealthBuilders for Women programme is ready to join as a waitlist at the moment. If this resonates with you, head to wealthbuilders.co.uk forward slash women, put your name down. There's no commitment. We're simply just gathering, I guess, a list of people that would be interested to find out more about this Tracy. If that list grows,


then we will work further on this together. And if someone's listening today and anything's holding them back, Tracy, any sort of words of encouragement that perhaps you might have felt three or four years ago?


these people, who, know, and wealth put it a great latest, but when people sell to me, I tend to go, no, I can do this myself. I'm quite independent. And if what I've learned for me, that's, that was the biggest mistake because I may have got there, but it would have taken me 20 years rather than, you know, my three years. So putting your name down on a wait list, doesn't mean that you have to do anything, but we want to make sure that there is a need for this, that people really do want to make a difference that they for one to grow and they want to learn in the area. So


For me, I'm hoping that we'll get the numbers that we've talked about and that we can support women in the right way. And putting your name down, there's not going to be a hard sell in any way. This is just about our first step to see whether there's a desire to make this happen. And I'm really hoping that we'll get the community behind us and the individuals behind us that want to join and be part of this for the future. So please, please join us. And I look forward to meeting you, working with you.


And obviously also with Chris and Kevin in a way that brings this to life.


Speaker 3 (28:22.03)

absolutely is possible to achieve financial independence within five years. Tracy, you are the proof of that. And thank you so much for sharing your story with us today.


Thanks a Chris. Appreciate it. Nice to see you and thanks again.


Speaker 3 (28:37.71)

Okay, thanks to Tracy for sharing those insights and we'll dive into those in a moment, Kevin. Before we do that, let's head over to TrustPilot where we've had a new review this week from Bina who says, are so grateful to Christian, Kevin and the team. We've recently joined WealthBuilders and the experience has been wonderful. We now have clarity and what we need to do a clear plan. The coaching calls also provide a great framework of keeping on track. Thank you WealthBuilders team.


Well, good to hear a lot. were two words that I want to pick out of that. If you don't mind, because, know, I was speaking to Bina and her husband recently. One is clarity. You know, I think the real importance, whenever you get confusion, you make poor decisions. You make less effective decisions. So the more you can give clarity, which is what I love to do, we love to do well builders.


Is clarity means you've got a clear vision and with that clear vision, you can make always one of three decisions, Chris. Do you accept the clarity and go, yeah, I've got it. I'm happy with it. Do you do something yourself or do you get some help to get it done to improve and make that vision clearer to where you want to be? And that's great that she's mentioned that and very specifically. And the second word I'd like to pick up is the word wonderful. A journey full of wonder.


Well, we know it's a transformational journey, isn't it? And being her husband at the beginning of that, and we know that life's going to change just as life changed quite dramatically. Well, it's not always dramatic. I'm going take that back. I'm going to take back dramatic. It's often that journey of change, like for Tracy, is gradual, isn't it? So the principles of taking small, smart action steps every single month.


can lead to massive changes, but they don't happen each month. They happen as a result of the compounding effect of that. By the way, one final point before you interrupt me is the same principles that say are equally shareable between men and women are equally shareable wherever you live in the world. As you heard the Antibody and Sound of Tracy's voice, those principles work, whether you live in Australia, whether you live in the UK or wherever you live. Some of the applications are different.


Speaker 2 (31:04.686)

but the principles are all.


Well, connection and community are two words that Tracy mentioned. It just so happens that I connected Beena with Tracy because they both live pretty close and I thought that would be a good introduction. Tracy, we've connected with people in the community and that has certainly helped on her own journey. I must actually also give a shout to Pritesh who is Beena's husband because Pritesh often messages me


the day the podcast comes out saying how much he enjoyed it. So I know that he would love to hear his own voice on a shout out.


the shout out. You know how whenever I'm speaking, normally have my sort of just as my own unique brand, I have my colored buttons, my contrasting buttons. I don't think I've got them today, but because I'm not on show, but not speaking. But I had a call with Pritesh and Bina and it was like warm as toast and he had a scarf around his neck. And they said, what are you doing with a scarf around your neck? He went, it's my unique brand and that's fine. So he's got a style, he's got a look.


And he's got his own focus together with Bina, so I wish them all the best. But good to hear that Tracy is such a sharing person, isn't she? You can tell. So willing to give. And we thought she'd be a great candidate to really shine a light much more on the path building process and the wealth building process for women. And we hope that her message acts as a clarion call.


Speaker 2 (32:34.062)

for others to join in. called it a movement, I think. She'd like to create a movement. And I think that's a beautiful word because it implies people rallying behind a call and doing something together to achieve it. And that's why I had to get out of the way and suggest that somebody else and maybe a group of women can get together to help each other, whether they use our principles or slightly amend them is fine. But it'd be great to hear if people resonate with what Tracy


has to say and jump on that waitlist. It's important for us to check that with the waitlist first, Chris, isn't it? Because we know waitlists are really important. What's your take on why we do that?


Well, we've said many times that when you come up with ideas, you might think they're the best idea in the whole world, but you need to validate that. And the best way is to get some feedback from the market and actually make sure there is a market that wants what it is that you think they want. So waitlist is a really good way for people to say, yeah, I'm interested in that. I'd like to find out, I'd like to be part of that. And you don't want to spend hours and hours or loads of money building something.


only then to release it and find that actually nobody else wants to buy it. So that's, know, why waitlist is such a good feature.


Yeah, because I have to call it the damp squib effect. You do something and nobody's interested. That's why we don't like damp squibs. We want to make sure we light the blue touch paper and accelerates. And I'm sure that will be the case. So it would be good to invite anybody who either knows someone who you think might be want to form part of the movement. If you know anybody who would want to be involved in it.


Speaker 2 (34:11.764)

If you're a female yourself and you think, yeah, I'd love to be part of a community of women building wealth, sharing the same language, sharing the same lessons, being vulnerable in the way they want to be and being helpful in the way they want to be. That would just be great to hear that messages resonating with people. if you've got a, mean, Tracy and us, Chris, we're based here in the UK. So if you're in the UK, we'd love to hear from you. But equally, if you want to build your own group.


you know, in a country where you are and we'd love to hear from you because we'd be happy to help you with resources and some ideas and maybe some of the principles we share. But unfortunately we don't have the energy, let's say, to be leading that in another country, but we're up for it.


Yeah, you can always get in touch with us by sending us an email hello at wealthbuilders.co.uk. But if you want to be part of that early movement, the Women in Wealth, WealthBuilders for Women, and it is early stages, so there's no commitment here. It's just really putting your name down and saying, hey, just keep me updated about this. And if you'd like to be part of that early beta group, just to provide input and be part of that community, then head to wealthbuilders.co.uk forward slash women.


And that's not the only waitlist. I just mentioned, Kevin, we talked about a waitlist a few weeks ago, didn't we, with the inheritance tax pension issue that's looming. So another waitlist where we've actually had, well, hundreds now of names. Yeah.


Yeah, and that's not going to go away anytime soon as we've already seen the government intervene still further. mean, they've, what have they done? They've bashed the farmers, they've bashed the business owners, they've bashed the property owners and they're bashing the pension holders, but there's another bash for the property owners coming as well. In theory anyway, at least we're hearing they want to apply national insurance contributions to rental income. You know, so they did the VAT on.


Speaker 2 (36:07.063)

School fees.


Hmm


Now potentially national insurance on rental. mean, look everywhere you look, you need to be completely financially aware of what's going on with governments. We know governments change and they'll make changes and they'll threaten changes, but those, those changes don't come into effect. So we don't know about that, but we know the black hole, which a year ago she said was 20 billion is now 50 billion black hole.

They've to get the money from somewhere, which means they've got to keep on bashing. And the challenge with all of this for me, Chris, is the short-term thinking. It's a big problem which can't be fixed by thinking about just the length of time of your parliament. You've always got political thinking that's foreshortened by electioneering. There's not really long-term planning and thinking. And some of these things like pensions, they need to be planned for a lifetime.

And it wouldn't surprise me if people started opting out pensions, know, and just saying, sorry, you know, this is just too difficult to maneuver in the landscape where there are landmines dropping everywhere. And after you've crossed the mine or crossed the path, they put them retrospectively, which is the worst of all political engineering really, to make changes after you've told people you're not going to change.

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or you've made the changes and then you backfill the changes that make it impossible for people to actually plan at all because they just don't know which way to turn. And that's going to create a life of uncertainty when the principle of building wealth is to create certainty. So I'm still not going to deviate from those principles of the best way to create certainty is to have multiple streams of recurring income. Yes, there are to be tax takes on those.

but to build them. And if you build it well enough, you should be able to create financial independence like Tracy, who's going on to bigger and better things, by the way, it's not the end of her journey. We know that because we in contact with her regularly. think her next ambition is to move into the commercial property space, know, making more use of her pensions and looking forward to meeting her again in person, just a couple of weeks away in an event that we're holding for

WealthBuilder members and a WealthBuilder partner. So we often do site visits and things where people can get together and see what's going on and the creativity that's going on in the lives of other WealthBuilders. And we definitely want to encourage creativity. Otherwise, if you shut down creativity and just accept that somebody else has control, you move from financial independence as a plan to financial dependency. So we cannot depend on what governments do for ourselves.

going to be thinking outside that box. So we will continue to push back on that and we'll continue to support people who want to bring political clarity in a space right now where there's anything but.

You're quite right, Kevin. One of anything is risky. Multiple streams of income, absolutely what we teach at Wealthbuilders. I guess a final quote from Tracy, one that you've shared many times, the original source certainly, somebody else that we both admire. How can I make money when I'm asleep? That's the essence, isn't it? Because if you don't learn how to make money whilst you're asleep, then you'll be forever working hard. Trading time.

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Well, yeah, I mean, I suppose you could tweak that and say, you know, life is financial independence about understanding and creating streams of recurring income. And if you don't really do that, you don't follow that and you don't appreciate that. And you end up really dependent on somebody else and you become part of somebody else's plan that you unwittingly a part of and you can't change it. So I encourage, you know, self-reliance, self-empowerment. Yes, you have to be involved.

You can't delegate wealth away. It's not possible because then you're just hoping for the best and hope is not a plan. anyway, enough soap boxes. There seem to be getting on them more and more, Chris. Maybe I'm just getting old. Maybe I should retire on the 300th episode. What do you think?

careful you don't slip. Okay, so thanks to Tracy for being a wonderful guest today on WealthTalk and Kevin, you and I will be back for the Big 300. Same time, same place next week.

We will indeed, I'll be there for that one, my friend. Until then, see ya.

Speaker 2 (40:51.8)

We hope you enjoy today's episode. Don't forget that we are contributing our resources inside the Wealthbuilders membership site to help you create, build and produce wealth. Head over to wealthbuilders.com slash membership right now for free. That's wealthbuilders.com slash membership.

the update.

Speaker 1 (40:59.214)

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