Pooling Family Assets For Massive Benefit

Transcript

speaker-0 (00:00.138)
SaaS is not like any other type of pension and actually we encourage people to think about it more like a business. It is entrepreneurial. It's almost like having another business tacked onto the side of your existing businesses, which gives you the ability to tap into finance available that has not been on the table prior to that. It can do many different things, including the stock market. whereas for most pensions, the stock market is the default or the only option, with a SaaS, the choice is

almost unlimited.

speaker-1 (00:33.646)
Hi there, this is Kevin Whelan, founder of Wealth Builders, and I'm joined today by my co-director, who looks after all of our SaaS proposition, and of course, very key player in our family wealth fortress, Mr. Paul Brooks. So, hi Paul, how's it going for you?

speaker-0 (00:49.614)
Yeah, I'm great. Thanks, Kevin. Good to see you.

speaker-1 (00:51.906)
Likewise, likewise, we do a little session today because we've been spending time really having some amazing conversations with families, creating the family wealth fortress and our target to help 100 really enlightened families to build, protect, and transfer their wealth in a superbly elegant way, a joined up and holistic way. But we thought we'd talk about the wider issue of kind of sharing.

And pooling, and I think we've titled this pooling for massive benefit. So why don't you introduce us Paul to the mindset that's fundamentally different from the way financial guidance is typically delivered, which is one-to-one or one to the immediate family and not thinking wider than that. So what's your thoughts around that?

speaker-0 (01:45.592)
Well, I think the entire financial industry is based around the principle of giving advice to a typical nuclear family unit. And let's say that might be husband and wife or whatever dynamic of a family that is, without thinking about the wider family and the connection, the natural interconnection that exists between different generations of the same family.

When most people do financial planning, even if they're not using an IFA or a financial planner, they're typically only thinking about themselves. But in doing that, they're missing out on a really big, actually massive benefit, which for two key reasons can have an enormous impact on the longevity and the sustainability of their wealth, especially when financial products are in play, which is saving of fees and the sort of impact of

accumulating and consolidating money together in a way that makes it much easier to plan for, much easier to invest and keep track of. And I think it, you know, we need a mindset shift to move away from the typical, you know, two partners scenario or even individual scenario where they're only thinking about what's immediately in front of them and the assets that are in their name.

to help people think about how they can tap into this value of pooling together wider family assets.

speaker-1 (03:21.166)
Yeah, okay. That's interesting. And given the logical and the common sense of that, you say it out loud, it makes sense. Why doesn't it happen?

speaker-0 (03:29.614)
Well, think a lot of it is down to, you know, financial planning typically only really circles around that nuclear family base, you know, and let's say, for example, if I took my family, myself and my wife, you know, if you go to see a financial advisor, generally speaking, their remit is only really to you and the products that you have and the objectives that you have without

thinking about trying to understand who is above you in the family tree, what we call our up-gen, Kevin, let's say parents or grandparents even, possibly, and what wealth do they have in a format that, let's say, may exist on a platform. I'm sure we'll come on to thinking a little bit about what that means, what the areas of pooling can be looked at are.

but thinking about moving up and assessing what's above you, what's to the side of you, siblings, for example, and depending on your own individual nuclear family circumstances, you may have adult children, you may have grandchildren, potentially even great grandchildren. So we're talking about potentially four or five layers of generation here that probably all have their money managed individually, either by financial advisors or institutions, or they do it on their own.

But there is a natural interconnectivity between all those people. You're all part of the same family. Why not benefit from having your money treated as if it's all part of the same package rather than in isolated silos, which is what really benefits the financial institutions that manage people's money.

speaker-1 (05:16.27)
So when you were talking about the principle of generations, up generation, down generation, side generation, with, let's say, us being, well, I'm a bit older than you, but being not too old and still got some marbles to have a conversation. But we all know, however, that there are members of families, the older generation, that often have closed down to that discussion.

and they won't be open to that. What are your thoughts around dealing with Upgeneration, whether they're willing or not willing to be engaged in the dialogue?

speaker-0 (05:54.21)
Well, I mean, think we're big advocates of, you know, active participation in dialogue. What does a legacy mean? What are the things that are important to the family through the generations? And a big part of what we teach with people on our wealth fortress is to have that dialogue and to make people of different generations feel comfortable with having a discussion about family wealth. And so this isn't about

taking money away from somebody. It's absolutely not that. It's about saying what you have in the format that you have it in could be made more efficient, which could save you money and therefore contribute more towards the income you might need in your life, the future legacy that you leave to your loved ones. And framed in that way, most people, irrespective of their financial nows or education,

are more likely to be open-minded to having a discussion as long as they understand this isn't about taking their money and doing something with it that they don't want to be done. It's absolutely not that. It's about saying, how can we make the money that you've got work harder for you, smarter for you, and therefore, by definition and connection, the entire family?

speaker-1 (07:11.982)
Okay, so that's good that you made that distinction about, it's not saying can I have some of your money to do something different with, it's keep your money where it is, but by looking at it in a different way, in a different space, with a different mindset, you can get a better result for everybody. Give an example then, let's say we talk about everybody's, families have got some kind of cash or savings, so talk to me about cash.

speaker-0 (07:39.512)
So there are lots of people who have cash in individual isolated bank accounts, irrespective of pooling with other family members. There are benefits of technology now that allow you to get access to a very wide range of banking options, interest-bearing savings accounts, for example, where you can achieve a few things.

you can protect your money from the failure of any one banking institution. And I'm sure there will be people listening to this that have got lots of money all held within a single banking institution, which is at risk if that banking institution would have some sort of financial problem. And we've seen that in the past, haven't we, in decades gone by where there's runs on the bank and financial institutions fail.

there are protection limits in place, but those protection limits are relatively small. know, 120,000 per banking institution recently increased, used to be 85. So you can achieve a more diverse spread of your money across different institutions rather than having it all pooled in the same bank account. You can benefit often from higher interest rates than you might typically get, especially if you've been using the same bank.

for years and years. And sometimes that runs through the generations actually, doesn't it? Well, I use so and so because my parents use them. Doesn't necessarily mean they're going to offer you the best return on your cash. And especially for people who are in a stage in their wealth journey where they're looking for more protection of capital and cash, a larger than normal part of their overall structure, it's important to maximize the return you get on that cash.

platforms exist which now give you access to a huge range of different bank accounts of all kinds of different shapes and sizes, you know, to cater for the needs of people, whether it's instant access through to long-term accounts. It can pool money that you have in your business if you're a business owner. It can pool money that you have personally and then with other family members, you can connect the dots between all of you and the different structures in your life to mean that

speaker-0 (09:58.454)
you're paying the least amount of fees that you need to be paying, you're getting access to potentially the highest rates of interest on your cash that you can achieve, and you're spreading the risk across different institutions, which means there's no single point of banking failure for your money.

speaker-1 (10:14.51)
I bet most people haven't even heard of this and know that it's even possible. In fact, one of the things I read recently, Paul, which made my blood boil a bit, was one big institution, a big private bank, made, last year, 87 million by doing just that. But they kept the money. They did not pass it to the family. They kept it as easy additional profit.

by them essentially managing the cash, but claiming that extra interest for themselves and making an arbitrage or a margin on the difference between the interest rate that they got for themselves and the interest rate they passed on to their clients. And I think that's in many respects, to be honest, shameful. And what you're able to explain to people is actually they can bring all that value that

rather than give somebody else the extra money, keeping the family. Does that work with other assets like stock market investments, for example?

speaker-0 (11:19.508)
It does. And the principle's almost exactly the same, actually. Nowadays, especially, the world of the stock market is driven almost entirely by technology. People don't hold share certificates and fund unit certificates in the way that perhaps they did in previous decades. There's an enormous fight between different providers of technology in the financial world, which actually has resulted in the price being driven down, which is fantastic because it means people can get access.

these things for a lower cost than has ever been possible before. And assuming they don't keep hold of the savings and assuming, of course, that people are aware of it and lots of people aren't. And we see people all day every week, actually, don't we, that are paying more, for example, in their stock market pensions than they could be in sorts of financial products like ISAs or general investment accounts. They're all the same. It's just the way they're treated from a tax perspective is different, but they're all the technology driven.

way of getting access to listed funds like Microsoft or listed shares or collective funds like the FTSE 100 so that you can get exposure to the returns of the stock market. You can take the same principle that I explained of pooling money you might have in an ISA or in a pension, but also in your partner's and if you've got anything in your business and you can

bring together these plots of money or connect them up so that you might still be in the same board set up with the same funds or the same shares, but you're now not paying a fee to that platform provider based on a percentage of the value of your part, which is how most of these platforms work. typically, let's say you might be paying 0.4 of a percent to have your money sat within a stock market account.

doing something. Separately, your parents might have some money and they might be paying 0.4%. But if you aggregate the value of those pots so that now the financial institution is looking at this as if it's one account and one pot of money, that might mean a reduction of say down to 0.2 % across the whole portfolio of money for you and for your parents rather than each of you paying a higher cost.

speaker-0 (13:38.946)
because your accounts are individual and segregated. And the compound impact of that fee saving is enormous.

speaker-1 (13:47.086)
especially if you compound that with the increased value of cash for how much cash you need, the decreased cost of managing money. And it's so rare for this benefit of technology to be passed on. There's countless numbers of institutions who've been criticized for charging higher fees just because they've got a flashy brochure or a swish way of demonstrating something. But in fact, all it is is making more money from

not passing on the cost and the benefits of technology. And we all know technology is bringing so many incredible benefits, but so late to the table, it seems to me, when it comes to financial things. And one of those things relatively poorly understood, which we know a lot about Paul and I suppose many listeners to the podcast have heard us talk about before, but the pooling money in pensions

which is never talked about with general financial planners. They never would suggest that because I suppose, you know, they profit more thinking about managing the money for themselves than the SaaS. So remind people what a SaaS is, not too complex if you don't mind, because I know you can get us very complexed in there. And then what are the unique things that SaaS can do where that pooling, because you can do a

pooling of pension money and who can be included in that pool and what might some of those benefits be.

speaker-0 (15:20.842)
SaaS is not like any other type of pension and actually, we encourage people to think about it more like a business because it looks and it operates a bit more like a business in that it is entrepreneurial. It can do many different things, including the stock market. But whereas for most pensions, the stock market is the default or the only option, with the SaaS, the choice is almost unlimited.

you can use the money to do all kinds of different things within your business, no matter what your business does. And chief among those things is something called a loanback, which I'll come on to in a moment. But it allows business owners, people with a limited company, to create a vehicle that can help them to use money they've built up in pensions in a very, different way. And very often in a way that is more aligned with their own skill, their own interests and their own feelings about the

kind of assets that are important to them, like property, for example. And the great thing about a SaaS, just like a business, is that it is multi-person, but it's also multi-generational. So when we were talking at the beginning, we were talking about looking at your up generation and your down generation. Well, it's no different here with the SaaS. If you have adult children in your life, for example, then you and your adult children

could create a SaaS together, pool money that you've each accumulated from various places in your working life, from pensions you own or personal pensions, and bring them all together into a vehicle that now operates just like a business. It's almost like having another business tacked onto the side of your existing businesses, which gives you the ability to tap into finance available that has not been on the table prior to that, giving you experience

the ability to take some of that money and use it in a way that is going to further your business in some way or another, for example. Certainly not exclusively just that. You can use it to invest in commercial property. You can use it to invest in the stock market, but usually in a very, very low cost way. And gold and all kinds of different things that more entrepreneurial, more entrepreneurially minded people are more inclined to value because there's still this feeling of distrust, isn't there, about pensions. People don't

speaker-0 (17:48.328)
like the stock market, it can be a bit unruly. They are concerned about the ebbs and the flows and the big peaks and troughs in value, especially when something way outside of their control happens and has an impact on the value. And the SaaS allows you to choose the things that will work for you and for your family and the returns and the income that you need in a way that other pensions can't.

speaker-1 (18:13.198)
And I'm assuming here you can control the cost. Nobody can control the stock market, but you can control the fees that you pay to access the stock market, notwithstanding SAS can do many other things. But the point you made about the pooling and being able to drive down the cost of money management in terms of stock market money management, can that be achieved inside of SAS as well?

speaker-0 (18:34.656)
It can, yes. If you imagine you've got different people bringing together different pots of money from various pensions and them all being accumulated into one place, instead of having the cost and the fees to manage two, three, four individual plots with varying fees, nearly always which are linked to the value, a percentage of the value, the fees are based on activity, not value.

And in theory, you'll know this isn't exactly the case, but as a principle, you could have a SaaS worth half a million pounds and be paying less than a stock market pension worth 200,000 pounds because the value that the SaaS brings is the ability to pay fees, firstly, that are not based on value, they're based on activity. Secondly,

Because a SaaS is a type of company pension, all the fees for running it are genuine tax deductible expenses for your business. So instead of paying the headline fee, actually you're getting tax relief on that because your business is claiming it as an expense. And that double impact, that compound impact again has a massive long-term benefit to the growth of the money and what you can then do with that over the time you're investing.

speaker-1 (19:53.696)
Okay. So what you're saying is if I've got a conventional pension or I'm a business owner with a SIP, the fees are being paid for from the fund itself, which is not tax deductible. But if I, with the SaaS, I can pay the fees directly. I can choose the investments I want. I can negotiate or choose the platform on which I hold the funds to keep the costs down. I'm not seeing too many negatives. What's the maximum number of people in the SaaS?

speaker-0 (20:22.38)
You can have up to 11 people including yourself, so 10 others. And as long as they're genuinely connected to you in some way or another, they can be invited to join your SaaS. But usually it's family members of some kind or another, whether it's your up generation or your adult children or brothers, sisters, whatever it might be, commonly partners, spouses or civil partners. We work with lots of couples of one variety or another, one shape or another.

But we're starting to see more, I suppose, because of the work we're doing and because of the changes that have been happening over the last few years, people are certainly definitely more interested in understanding how they can bring their children into a pension and some of the benefits of that, including something called earmarking, which I guess we'll touch on in a second, be a really powerful tool, especially for reducing inheritance tax, which is...

know on most people's minds at the moment given the changes that are coming next April.

speaker-1 (21:24.276)
As a keen reader and listener to what's going on in the financial world, I saw that when surveyed and published in all of our financial documents, inheritance tax was the biggest and most concerning area for families to consider now more than ever before. And of course, that's brought in a much sharper focus with the introduction of inheritance tax on pensions in 2027. And while I could be tempted yet again to get on my soapbox, I will not do that today because this is about

your knowledge and your sharing. I'll shut up about that, but tell us what the inheritance tax benefits are that are unique to SAS. You can't do them in a SIP, you can't do them in a workplace pension, you can't do them in a stakeholder pension or personal pension. And you've talked about the pooling already, but how does the other ideas that you can use in SAS help with inheritance tax if that was your

speaker-0 (22:21.23)
Well, there are two ways actually. The first way is something I mentioned just a moment ago, which is earmarking. And what that means is, imagine you've created a SaaS and you've brought together the various pots of money of different family members. Let's say, know, parents and children, adult children.

speaker-0 (22:40.622)
By default, what a SaaS does, unless you tell it otherwise, is you invest the money as a unit, the returns come back, and then the returns are applied to each member based on the amount of money, the proportion that they've got in the SaaS.

But there is another way of doing things. And the other way of doing things says, well, actually, no, we don't want to do that. Let's imagine the parents are in a position where they already have an inheritance tax problem. And they've created a scenario for themselves where there's enough income and wealth in their life to mean that actually they're not reliant on getting the absolute biggest pension points possible to have. So instead, they choose tax.

to assign individual assets within the SaaS, bearing in mind this is one vehicle that might have property, it might have a loan in it, it might have stock market things in it. All of those things have got different returns. Some of them might be capital growth, some of them might be income, but the point is the same. Each one of them will have a return that you could apply to it in each year. And what you can do is say, well, actually what we want to do is

deliberately slow down the rate at which our money grows because we want to artificially accelerate the rate of growth that our children grow. So, you know, imagine you had a property in the SaaS that was returning 8 % and you had a stock market portfolio or a cash portfolio that was returning 4%. Without getting too into the detail, what you could do is say, OK, well, we want to assign the commercial property, which is giving the highest return to the children.

and we want to assign the cash that is delivering the lowest return to us. And you can continue to do that every year so that instead of everyone getting a proportionate return, you're slowing down the growth on your pot. So the double benefit for the children is one, their pot's growing quicker, which means they will have a bigger pension at some point in the future available to them. But when something happens to the parents and

speaker-0 (24:48.482)
they've both passed away and that's the point at which the inheritance tax problem becomes a real problem, the tax is due. Because you've stagnated the growth of the pot, it's worth less. And because it's worth less, there's less tax to pay.

speaker-1 (25:02.36)
That's a very clever way of being able to think strategically inside a pension for the benefit of not just growth and returns, but also the tax on those returns, given that the tax is coming. And that isn't something that would have been high on anybody's priority list until this became announced, which was October 24, and it now becomes literally just around the corner, isn't it really?

I think it's important if you've got a reasonable pot size and you've got a feeling for, you've got other assets in your life that likely would mean your pension is going to add to the inheritor's tax bill, you give this another listen or a serious thought. But there are more ways that you mentioned one that was earmarking the cascading effect of money down to different generations. What about anything else?

speaker-0 (25:57.666)
Well, the other really powerful tool in the SAS toolbox is something called a SAS loanback, which is effectively entirely unique to SAS. No other pension can do this. And it allows the business owners who've created the SAS to effectively borrow money from the SAS to enhance or further what the business does.

is absolutely. It couldn't be any friendlier than yourself, could it? You're the borrower and the lender. So the chances of you approving the loan are pretty high, I would hope. And there are lots of friendly features in a loan back, not least the rate of interest that you have to pay for the privilege of borrowing your own money. Now, we're business owners of all kinds, don't we? And many of those business owners are interested in using their SaaS to help.

get more recurring income and therefore property is a big part of their wealth building plan. And that's just an example, but it's a good one because the SaaS has a rate of interest that by law must be charged, which is roughly speaking, one over base. But if you think about approaching a bank or a bridging company to try and borrow money, let's say for a property project or for any other trading activity.

going be paying one over base, you're going to be paying a far higher rate and in particular with bridging, which can be easily 10, 12, 14, 15 per cent per annum plus all the exit fees and the entry fees and all the fees they charge halfway through the loan and all sorts of other things.

speaker-1 (27:41.122)
So are you saying you can make a loan to yourself without charging yourself a fee, pay as little as one over base, and don't know if base rate changed today, but because we're speaking on a Thursday, but if base rate is, what is it, three and three quarters. Yeah. So it's three and three quarters. So four and three quarters, 4.75. I can borrow money from myself into my limited company.

at four and three quarters with no fees, no underwriting, and I'll be as friendly as I want to myself. You must be having a laugh with me, Paul.

speaker-0 (28:17.004)
You'd think so, but you know, it's like SaaS, we always joke as being the best kept secret in pensions. The most powerful element of a SaaS for most people is the ability to be able to tap into this incredibly low cost money. And there are some rules and, know, chief among those is making sure that the money is secured and protected, which is important, but you can borrow up to half of the pot. And if you've built a reasonably substantial pot of money,

Especially if you can bring together various pots and the same for your spouse or your civil partner or your children or even business partners. Business partners can bring together their money. doesn't have to just be about family. then you can use up to 50 % of the total value of the SaaS, either in one loan or in a series of different loans. It's incredibly powerful.

And the saving and fees alone can be tens of thousands of pounds in a single loan, let alone if you extrapolate that out over a number of years.

speaker-1 (29:22.092)
You haven't even touched on the IHT benefit.

speaker-0 (29:24.48)
No, and I was just going to come to that. So from an IHT perspective, if you think back to the point earmarking, is to firstly to choose what returns go to who. It has to be done proportionately. You you can't assign all the returns of a half a million pound asset to someone who's only got 50,000 pounds in the pot. You can then lend some of the money to the company, which achieves two things. One.

rate of return, assuming you pick the minimum interest rate, and if you're to stagnate the growth of the pot, then of course you might choose to do that, remains low. And especially if you've earmarked that loan back to you and your other half, let's say, then you're choosing the lower rate of return. And two, if you've got a company that has your children as part of that, bearing in mind that the children are the next generation, they're the people that are going to inherit the family wealth and the plan,

And the challenge of inheritance tax comes from typically the parents passing onto the children. You can structure a company in a way that means it's got multiple shareholders of different generations, just like you can have multiple generations in a SaaS. So what you can do is borrow the money. The company has the money, it invested in whatever way it does to generate the profit or the income. And instead of all of that

profits sitting with the parents as the shareholders. If you've structured your business in a way that means you've got the next generation in as shareholders, then some of that profit will naturally accumulate in their name, which again means it's now outside of your personal tax problem, which means it's not accessible to IHT because it's already removed because they have the right to that share of the profit or the income.

So those two things, either used in isolation or together, are an incredibly powerful way of reducing the inheritance tax, not just in the pension, but potentially in the wider plan and the business too.

speaker-1 (31:33.518)
you had a hundred business owners in a room, how many of would know this?

speaker-0 (31:36.94)
I mean, I'd be amazed if 10 people put their hands up.

speaker-1 (31:39.628)
Okay. I'll be amazed if one, because people will have heard the word SaaS maybe, but they won't know how to structure this. So this is something again, if you're a business owner, you've got a reasonable pension pot, you've got a family, maybe you've got a spouse, maybe you've got business partners, you've got people in your life that you love or care for. Then this is a very powerful thing to explore and decide whether it might be a good fit for you. And of course.

From a wealth builder's perspective, we spend time with people for free, don't we, to help them understand the costs and the benefits because unlike any traditional financial company wants to charge a percentage, you we want to get a result, don't we? Are we kind of focused on getting an absolutely concrete guaranteed return? That means you don't do it unless it's going to make you more money, save you more money, or protect your money in a better way.

Right. That's cool. I like those things. So we can, we can pull our cash. We can pull our money to reduce fees. We can pull our money to get pension benefit. We can pull our money for an IHT benefit. What about, all this is about sharing benefit. What about sharing experiences? What can happen inside a family or inside a SaaS or a family investment company or whatever to help.

the next generation equip themselves with more knowledge and more capability because there's nobody teaching financial competence at school, university, or workplace. So what kind of things happen inside the families that we would normally work with, Paul, to share the wisdom?

speaker-0 (33:25.762)
think there are some core things that we always put into the concept of this family wealth fortress or this principle, is to bring in your, at least let's say your adult children and possibly even younger, but your adult children into the fold sooner rather than later. Help them understand what you're doing and why you're doing it and why it's important. Because the sooner you bring them in,

and the more involved and knowledgeable they become, the better the custodians of that wealth they will be when it eventually passes to them. And we hear all kinds of stories, including some horror stories where people have died and they are responsible for all the finances in the family, they hold the financial purse strings, and the survivor has to try and pick up.

at a time where things were already incredibly tough because they've lost a loved one, I have to try and pick up the pieces and work out what does this mean and where is the income coming and what do have to do and who do I need to speak to? So it's, yeah, for me, I think it's about making sure that there's a core set of family values that you teach to your children from an early period of your planning. Of course, absolutely. And there are a set of

emergency procedures, let's call them, that you put in place that says, look, if something happens and I go out tonight and I don't come back again, here's where you go, here's what you'll find, and here's who you need to talk to to help you with anything. But give those people in your life that you love the confidence and the clarity of where things are and how they work.

speaker-1 (35:12.002)
I mean, that's a very powerful point, not just for the next generation, but also for those families where, know, so typically someone like me with a wife five years younger, who's not as financially tuned in because not a day-to-day thing, you know, she's not going to be as comfortable with the complexity and all of those things. having the knowledge, having the, I suppose the place where knowledge is kept as well. So talk to me about the different ways that.

This information is kept and made accessible rather than scratching around dad's study to try and find out where on earth is the SAS? What on earth is the password? Where do I find the lost pensions or the pensions from when he was in his twenties or thirties or whatever it would be? What's the way to do that that you're seeing that's really useful to consider now?

speaker-0 (36:05.31)
In a way, it's another type of pooling. You're pooling documents and that might be physical documents, but more often than not nowadays. And we've talked about technology and platforms. There are some really fantastic technology solutions that you can use to virtually pool together all of the key things that are relevant to your family, to your finances in a place where

It's securely stored online in like a digital vault, which you give access to people with a digital key, know, who those might be, people might be in your life. And it's done in a way that means it's clear, everything's collected together in a single place, clearly documented. So it's easy to see what to go, where to go and what to get. It's protected, it's, you know, encrypted and so it's safe. So the first place would be

a digital storage for all of the key things in your life. Those things that are kept in a physical format as well, like wills, for example, you you will have a physical copy of the will signed and sort of kept safe. The other place that you would pull together those documents would be in a sort of fireproof, waterproof, secure container file that you have to have physical. Yeah, exactly.

For the things that you have to have stored physically, you've got a place where you know that if something happened in the house, they'd be protected so they could then be found and used in the event of some sort of disaster.

speaker-1 (37:44.93)
And of course, if you've got a safe with a password or whatever, you can store that in your digital vault. So a bit like in an emergency, smash the glass, you know, in an emergency, here's where to go and get the information. And we actually call it an ICE file, don't we, in case of emergency. So lots of things to deal with the positives, deal with the inevitabilities of life. And also some of these digital vaults, Paul, we're talking about can, can be really good for shared memories and shared things, you know, so often.

It's difficult to get all your photographs together to remember things that, which is I've seen one digital vault saying they're storing and getting the younger generation to record the older generation talking about how did you meet, how did granddad meet grandma and how did those things happen? So their voices can be stored and kept and those things can be played back to them when the marbles have fallen out to just to help.

stop the onset of people getting just older and I suppose, well, we know how mentally people are affected as they get older. there's lots and lots of real benefits of all the sharing going on.

speaker-0 (38:57.71)
But also as well, you know, I think what a lovely thing to be able to look back at 10, 15, 20 years down the line, a video of your grandparents talking about how they met. you know, I always remember my granddad, both my granddads were in the war actually, you know, talking to my granddads about what they did and their experiences and those sort of memories are priceless, but they fade over time, don't they? You know, and if you can

protect them and lock them away in a safe space and know that they'll always be there. What a fantastic thing. Yeah, aside from wealth and family values.

speaker-1 (39:30.542)
Right. And then, know, was interesting recently, because my brother had used AI to take a picture of my parents on their wedding day, you know, which is black and white picture. I'd actually turned it into a video of them kissing. It was amazing. Yeah. Good stuff. Anyway, stop the old blubber going. It's so powerful, but...

If you get those shared emotions, you know, you've got a very powerful thing to do. So that was great. Paul, you've done a very powerful thing and in a great job of helping us understand why pooling can bring massive benefit. So thank you to you and look forward to inviting you on another episode of wealth talk. Well, we'll find some other massive benefits and you can shine a light on those things for our members and our listeners to find out more. I'll post the link to.

where people can find out a little bit more about the family wealth fortress. Maybe what we can do Paul in the coming weeks is a big guide to the inheritance tax problem coming in 2027. But maybe we can take, which is 50 pages, that's quite deep. Maybe we can take out the pages specifically on SAS just to give people an easy read, a five or a six page read and post that. So why don't we do that so we can make things accessible so people can get them so it's not too deep.

and too hard to find something that they can act on and get some of the benefit from some of the pooling examples that you've given today. thanks for coming today. Appreciate it.

speaker-0 (41:07.566)
My pleasure. Good to see you again, Kevin. Take care.

speaker-1 (41:12.632)
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